Curse

bobeep · Sep 17, 2005, 08:58 PM // 20:58

After using fragility I came to one conclusion you need max damage for it to be useful. For example, you need at least 16 in marksmenship. Also, you should add hunters shot in there, which is a nice plus damage (low energy) skill that can add another condition.

I can't remember my exact setup but it could kill any caster in two shots, and a war in about four, and didn't have any energy problems (unless the game was going pretty long).

R/ME

16 marksmen ship
12 illusion
4 expertise (just using left over points) +1 from rune of minor

Weapon - Bow with armour penetration and +1 to marksmenship
** Make sure to take a flatbow (ive tried short ones and they suck, with force of nature you can smoke that at longer distances, because your arrows travel faster so less change of missing).
Armour - Anything with lightning resist

1. Incendiary
2. hunters shot
3. fragility
4. whirling defense
5. (can't remeber, might be storm chaser)
6. trolls unguent/pin down
7. force of nature
8. res sig

Like I said I can't remeber skill for skill what it was, but this should get you started. Cast force of nature close to the battle area. Just run up to some caster cast frag, and use incendiary and the use hunters shot (they always run around anyway).

In my opinon for a frag ranger to be successful he/she has got to do mega damage with or without frag, so when you use frag on top of it all it will hurt even more. You can't afford to skimp on marksmenship and illusion.

Odd Sock · Sep 17, 2005, 09:13 PM // 21:13

I find it hard to believe that skill setup can do anything useful in a fight. You have a slow refire-rate meaning you trigger fragility less often which in return means you deal less damage. Second, what the hell is Force of Nature ? Third, you're running Troll Unguent on 0 Wilderness, you're basically waiting 3 seconds to start healing on 4 pips. Finally, killing casters in 2 shots is the biggest load of **** I've ever heard. GG 200+ damage per shot, I want pics of that.

EDIT: you're running 4 experise and say you have no energy problems ? Yea so your energy management is sitting around doing nothing waiting for the pips to regen your blue bar ? I could see that working but it doesn't mean it's any good.

bobeep · Sep 17, 2005, 10:14 PM // 22:14

Calm down... (*its only a game*) The build works, though there are a few skills I can't remember exactly, which are slots 5,6,7. The rest I remeber. This build works, and I had enough success with it to state that. Do a hunters shot with frag and incendiary on a caster. A regular shot (40-60+) + 2 conditions (60) + the condition ending (30) + 15-19 extra damage with hunters, + running target which = critical hit + the second of fire and bleeding, which is a bit more damage + 6 from force of nautre (if its in there). It is pretty close to 200 damage a shot and most casters overstock on sup ruins so it's not hard to believe they may have around 380 health which = two hit kill.

I know it blows your mind that there could be a variation of a classic build, but sometimes people can come with something half decent, I suggest you go try it yourself.

** Im almost certain I used force of nature, it seems to popup in allmy ranger primary builds except an IW r/me. I think unguent was replaced by pin-down.

twicky_kid · Sep 17, 2005, 10:39 PM // 22:39

its called favorable winds not force of nature

i would like to see a force of nature skill though even though MtG may have it copyrighted. it would be cool to summon some ents or plant creatures.

KuTeBaka · Sep 18, 2005, 01:00 AM // 01:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobeep

Calm down... (*its only a game*) The build works, though there are a few skills I can't remember exactly, which are slots 5,6,7. The rest I remeber. This build works, and I had enough success with it to state that. Do a hunters shot with frag and incendiary on a caster. A regular shot (40-60+) + 2 conditions (60) + the condition ending (30) + 15-19 extra damage with hunters, + running target which = critical hit + the second of fire and bleeding, which is a bit more damage + 6 from force of nautre (if its in there). It is pretty close to 200 damage a shot and most casters overstock on sup ruins so it's not hard to believe they may have around 380 health which = two hit kill.

I know it blows your mind that there could be a variation of a classic build, but sometimes people can come with something half decent, I suggest you go try it yourself.

** Im almost certain I used force of nature, it seems to popup in allmy ranger primary builds except an IW r/me. I think unguent was replaced by pin-down.

okay... fragility=15 energy. incentary = 5, hunters= 5. you now have 5 energy left, and a regular shot is not 40-60 damage. It is around 20 something. If the caster is not moving then there is no bleeding, then you will only have +60 from the burning. 15 damage bonus from hunters shot, that makes a little less than 100. You wasted all the energy you have for a 100 shot spike. Just go with chain lightning or something.

audioaxes · Sep 18, 2005, 04:11 AM // 04:11

you have way too many energy heavy spells in that build that you couldnt really utilize

Six String Samurai · Sep 18, 2005, 05:01 AM // 05:01

you'd probably be better off going mesmer/ranger and bringing a snare with you into random arena.

Odd Sock · Sep 18, 2005, 03:07 PM // 15:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobeep

I know it blows your mind that there could be a variation of a classic build, but sometimes people can come with something half decent, I suggest you go try it yourself

Just from the energy stand-point your build can't work. I'm very open to new ideas and builds but when it's outright obvious it can't work I won't stand there and listen to you claiming that the specified build is glorious.

Look at the energy in the build you posted consiering you have 4 expertise
Incendiary Arrows - 5 energy, becomes 4 energy
Hunter's Shot - idem
Fragility - 15 energy
Whirling - who cares, you probably won't be using it
Pin Down - 15 energy, becomes 13 energy

So the evolution of your setup goes as following during a fight
Fragility 15 energy
Incendiary 19 energy
Hunter's Shot 23 energy
Pin Down 36 energy
Energy left: 0, Now what are you supposed to do ?

My question isn't can you swing it once ? cause with the pips you should be able to. My question is your effectiveness after the first encounter and what are you supposed to do if the hex is removed ? The build I posted has 2 interrupts so at least when you're not on incendiary you're contributing to both damage and interruption, it also has very little energy problems since expertise costs were factored in

Knido · Sep 18, 2005, 06:39 PM // 18:39

if you did team areana and had a necro with virulence, itd be awesome

chudak · Sep 18, 2005, 07:41 PM // 19:41

This is what I use atm and it works fine for me :

1. Hunter's shot
2. Savage shot
3. Pin Down
4. Throw Dirt
5. Rez Signet
6. Tigers Fury
7. Inc. Arrows [E]
8. Fragility

Stats are around this, i might gave or aded 1 to something but I think i didn't :
illusion 10
wild. survival 0
expertise 12
marksmanship 11

smurfhunter · Sep 19, 2005, 03:07 PM // 15:07

ever since frag mesmers have been running around, in TA i go full prot with restore conditions as the elit. if someones fragged i use restore condition, bring them to full hp and then inspired hex. owns.

if somethings rechraging just use shielding hands. it gimps the damage from frags.

UberRusty · Sep 19, 2005, 03:22 PM // 15:22

Frag Rangers suck.

Odd Sock · Sep 20, 2005, 01:36 PM // 13:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by UberRusty

Frag Rangers suck.

That's not very constructive. You claim they suck yet offer no facts to back up your claim. If your goal was to look like an negative ignorant then you sure did point that across.

Cheers

smedge · Sep 20, 2005, 06:40 PM // 18:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by KuTeBaka

one fragility will drain your energy completely. go me/r for more damage and energy.

Have you ever played a ranger before. They have quite a bit more than 15 Energy. Running expertise hi makes everything else cost a negligible amount too.

I like to also run apply poison. The instant my inc arrows runs out I charge up apply poison and start degenning the target. If you time it right you also get anothe rfrag trigger. This helps fill the gap nicely where you are waiting for inc arrows to cooldown.

UberRusty · Sep 20, 2005, 06:43 PM // 18:43

Quote:

That's not very constructive. You claim they suck yet offer no facts to back up your claim. If your goal was to look like an negative ignorant then you sure did point that across.

That was the point.

Cheers.

But, just for arguement's sake and flaming's sake.

Why do Frag Rangers suck?

1. 8 second time period to do damage, followed by a long recharge.

2. Arrows can miss.

3. Damage based on one hex. Unless you use a cover hex. See below:

4. Unless you're running Me/R, you do not have mucho energy after you Frag one target, and much less if you use a cover hex.

5. To sum it all up, too situational.

Yukito Kunisaki · Sep 20, 2005, 06:50 PM // 18:50

Not only is it too situational, but having interrupts as a meager backup just doesn't justify that a warrior running frenzy and then spiking you with Eviscerate + Exe Strike will pretty much chop you in half...

Being too easy to counter also doesn't help...

smurfhunter · Sep 20, 2005, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by UberRusty

That was the point.

Cheers.

But, just for arguement's sake and flaming's sake.

Why do Frag Rangers suck?

1. 8 second time period to do damage, followed by a long recharge.

2. Arrows can miss.

3. Damage based on one hex. Unless you use a cover hex. See below:

4. Unless you're running Me/R, you do not have mucho energy after you Frag one target, and much less if you use a cover hex.

5. To sum it all up, too situational.

in 4-4 this works wonders since almost no one has hex removal, or guardian/aegis equivalents. running? heck most nooby squishies run to you under the impression that they can just own you 1-1. and while you wait you arent exactly useless... i mean savage shot/distracting shot anyone? that frag takes up like 3 places in your skill bar. get creative with the other 5.

smedge · Sep 20, 2005, 09:54 PM // 21:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki

but having interrupts as a meager backup...

Thats why i use apply poison during the 16 second gap where inc arrows is recharging. It applys good degen to a very badly wounded target (assuming they survived the frag spike which isnt often) and triggers another frag hit. Once the target drops I like to spread the poison around to multiple foes if my inc arrows isnt recharged yet.

People who say frag rangers suck haven't played one or at least haven't played one well. They are the most damaging fragility build hands down. During that 8 seconds you are taking nearly 100dps and getting interrupted every 1.3 seconds. Not much survives that.

Arguing that fragility is useless because of hex remove isn't valid either. There are ways around hex remove. There isnt a single build in guild wars without it's achilles heel.

Odd Sock · Sep 20, 2005, 10:01 PM // 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by UberRusty

1. 8 second time period to do damage, followed by a long recharge.

In arena, if you get the first kill early it's often the turning point in the fight. All you need is 8 seconds to down pretty much anything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UberRusty

2. Arrows can miss.

Look at the build I posted, you're already in melee range. You won't miss unless he uses something like Aegis or Guardian. Arena monks are too bad to use any of those skills, so basically you own them. Then theres rangers and warriors with stances, but honestly who cares. Once the casters are dead it's pretty much game over.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UberRusty

3. Damage based on one hex. Unless you use a cover hex. See below:

You don't, you interrupt his hex removal. That's why you have 2 interrupt skills.

Quote:

Originally Posted by UberRusty

4. Unless you're running Me/R, you do not have mucho energy after you Frag one target, and much less if you use a cover hex.

See above. You also have expertise to reduce all the other costs. I run that build almost every night in arena when we're idling, you don't run out of energy... especially not with a zealous component

Quote:

Originally Posted by UberRusty

5. To sum it all up, too situational.

Not in random arena. This build is utter trash in tombs or GvG, I totally agree with you. But for an environment where there are no evades or hex removals it's t3h pwz0r (or however 13 year olds spell it). You always get your kill and one person down means it's a 3v4. You're also very useful for that downtime, you have two interrupts to destroy elementalists and necros with.

GG

UberRusty · Sep 21, 2005, 12:07 AM // 00:07

I didn't read it was for Comp Arena because I was a

Quote:

"negative ignorant"

You forgot to add idiot. :O

EDIT: I thought this build was aimed at 4v4 Teams Arena. In Comp Arena... I really wouldn't know, sorry for the missassumption.

Now for other replies:

@ smurfhunter + OddSock:

Quote:

in 4-4 this works wonders since almost no one has hex removal, or guardian/aegis equivalents. running? heck most nooby squishies run to you under the impression that they can just own you 1-1. and while you wait you arent exactly useless... i mean savage shot/distracting shot anyone? that frag takes up like 3 places in your skill bar. get creative with the other 5.

+

Quote:

You don't, you interrupt his hex removal. That's why you have 2 interrupt skills.

I'm assuming this statement is based on Comp Arena and not 4v4? Because switching targets to interrupt another guy casting hex removal = difficult to time and unless you're this uber l337 ranger with high battle awareness, you will probably misstime it.

@ Sledge:

Quote:

People who say frag rangers suck haven't played one or at least haven't played one well.

Well in that case it seems I haven't met a good Frag Ranger yet in 4v4.

Quote:

Arguing that fragility is useless because of hex remove isn't valid either. There are ways around hex remove. There isnt a single build in guild wars without it's achilles heel.

Exactly. But if you can't argue that blah blah is useless because of blah blah, even though I stated more than Hex Removal, why bother arguing? Except in this build, Achilles has a pretty big foot.